The Pro-Choice Quiz
By , Published February 17th, 2012

Ultrasound of BabyAre you really pro-choice?  Take this simple quiz to find out now!

Question 1:  It is alright to tear apart a newborn infant if…

A)  The mother cannot afford to care for the child.

B)  The child is mentally handicapped.

C)  The mother was raped.

D)  All of the above.

E)  None of the above.

If you selected (A) through (D), you are pro-choice.  If you selected (E), you might be pro-choice; proceed to the next question.

Question 2:  Is a human fetus a human (i.e. a member of the species Homo sapiens)?

A)     No

B)      Yes

If you selected (A), you are pro-choice.  If you selected (B), you might be pro-choice; proceed to the next question.

Question 3:  The value of a human is determined by…

A)    The human’s size.

B)     The human’s level of development.

C)     The human’s degree of dependency.

D)     All of the above.

E)      None of the above.

If you selected (A) through (D), you are pro-choice.  If you selected (E), you are not pro-choice; welcome to the ranks of the anti-choice fanatics.

______________________________________________

Murray Vasser is a student who blogs at www.murrayvasser.blogspot.com.
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  • Liz

    ProChoice arguments are inapplicable to infants as infants do NOT reside inside the body of other.

    Is a human fetus HUMAN? (er…duh?) A human BEING or person on the other hand…Regardless, actual people don’t reserve the right to use someone’s body without their initial and continued consent.

    The value of human life is determined by a variety of factors. Most importantly: NO ONE has the right to life at the expense of someone’s liberty, health or life.

    Your movement would probably be more effective if you put forth rational, intelligent arguments instead of focusing on debunking strawman talking points.

    • notimportant

      How can a newly fertilized ovum obtain initial consent? It is actually sort of implied upon engaging in sex that this may be a result…therefore (and despite taking any and all precautions that may or may not fail) the consent is implied on the part of the woman. Sorry to not include men there (although he is quite responsible too), but in this case I am speaking purely with regards to the one who will be pregnant. She implies consent to a possible pregnancy when she engages in sex- either protected or unprotected.

      So the mother maintains her right to liberty, life or health at the expense of the baby’s liberty, life or health? It is unfortunate that they are yolked together like a chain gang, but that is the way the cookie crumbles. However, she (mother) can be free upon delivery, should she choose adoption. I realize her life will never be the same after delivering a baby, but that is something she should consider before consenting to sex….and all it implies.

      • Letscook1

         Pregnancy in itself is very expensive. A labor and delivery is generally around 7,000- over 40,000. Women loose their jobs (even though it is illegal) over pregnancy all the time. The life and liberty of the host always takes president over the incubatee. If you feel that people should be forced to use their bodies to keep others alive because “life is so precious” you should advocate that everyone has to donate blood every 3 months and that all dead people’s bodies should be used for organ harvest. Both of these are FAR less intrusive than pregnancy.

        • Elise77

          Here is a brief biology lesson: The male reproductive organ produces sperm when stimulated. Insertion of a male reproductive organ into a female reproductive organ produces such stimulation. Sperm can fertilize ova, which produces a zygote (a human being in its earliest, most rudimentary form). A woman’s reproductive system contains ova. Therefore, it is understood that a human being may be formed when one inserts a male reproductive organ into a female reproductive organ.

          It is not the resultant human being’s fault that its parents performed the act described above, nor is it the resultant human being’s fault that labor and delivery costs so much (although fyi, unemployed or uninsured pregnant women generally qualify for Medicaid).

          I donate blood, but I’m not forced to do so, because I am not responsible for the factors that might necessitate somebody else’s blood transfusion. I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR THEIR EXISTENCE, let alone their health.

          However, a pregnant woman IS responsible (generally) for the existence of her unborn child. Unless she is very VERY young and naive or mentally impaired, she understood at the time when she allowed a male to insert his reproductive organ into hers that a human life could potentially result.

          Actions have consequences. Nobody “forces” a woman who has participated in consensual sex to be pregnant. Pregnancy is a natural consequence of sex. She could just as easily have caught herpes or HIV. Nobody claims that she is a “forced” carrier of herpes or HIV. Pregnancy is a self-limiting condition, unlike herpes or HIV. Nine months and VOILA! She’s CURED! It should be understood by every person having or contemplating sex that there are some risks that they assume as part of the deal. It’s not like they weren’t warned. One of the potential risks is nine months of inconvenience. (The next eighteen years is optional.)

          • guest

             Some women get pregnant even if they don’t consent. And yes, women who are poor and pregnant usually qualify for Medicaid. But Santorum, the lunatic pro-lifer, wants to get rid of  Medicaid, leaving pregnant women NO prenatal care. What kind of morals are those?

          • Elise77

            First of all, I acknowledged that there is such a thing as conception via rape. Since you pro-choicers love to use the very small number of women who abort due to conception via rape to justify legal abortion, will you then at least agree to outlaw abortion in the other 99% of cases, when the pregnancy is a result of consensual sex? Can we agree that if a woman doesn’t deserve to be violated and impregnated against her will, then a baby certainly doesn’t deserve to be dismembered and killed against his/her will?

            Secondly, I don’t remember campaigning for Santorum. What the heck does he have to do with this conversation? Besides which, you’re misunderstanding and/or misrepresenting his stance on Medicaid. http://www.issues2000.org/2012/Rick_Santorum_Welfare_+_Poverty.htm

          • Letscook1

             So loosing your job, death, or permanent disability are only inconveniences?

            Is getting in a car “consent” to be in a car wreck?

          • Elise77

            Let’s flat-out put words in my mouth, shall we? Did I (or ANYONE ELSE HERE ANYWHERE) say that a pregnancy must continue despite significant chance of permanent disability or death for the mother?? Because I don’t seem to recall that. HERE’S where you should reference Santorum: His wife was induced to prematurely deliver their son, knowing he was probably not going to survive, because her life was in danger. In effect they “terminated the pregnancy” which is distinguished from abortion in that they did NOT deliberately terminate THE CHILD. (He died, sadly, but he was afforded the dignity and respect and love of being delivered into the arms of his loving parents, vs. ripped limb from limb and vacuumed out of his mother’s womb or partially delivered and stabbed in the brain.) And I have yet to see anyone argue that Mrs. Santorum should’ve placed her life and her family’s well-being at further risk by attempting to carry the baby to term.

            Yes, when compared to DEATH, losing (not “loosing”) your job is an inconvenience. Let’s say your boss hates your mate. Does that give you the right to murder your mate in order to keep your job? HOW IS IT BETTER to murder your baby in order to satisfy your employer, than to risk wrongful termination AND SUE HIM FOR IT if he fires you??

            And no, getting in a car isn’t “consent” to get in a wreck, but it does imply the understanding that you COULD end up in a wreck and end up laid up in the hospital in traction for nine months- this is something you simply don’t get to “opt out” of. The fact that you carry car insurance acknowledges that possibility. And if someone else is responsible for your accident, you can make them pay, but you CAN NOT kill them in retribution, much LESS kill an INNOCENT BYSTANDER. And if YOU are responsible for the accident, then YOU are responsible to deal with the results. You don’t get to victimize someone else to avoid taking responsibility for your actions.

          • Misschels

            Why do you want women punished for having sex?  Your sex life must suck. By your logic, everytime you drive, you consent to crashing. Everytime you swim, you consent to drowning. See where I’m going with this?

            Sex is NOT just for procreation, nor is it a right only reserved for people who want to be parents. Get with the times. People can have sex for pleasure without being forced to breed. I don’t have to continue a pregnancy to just to make YOU happy.

            No, a woman is NOT responsible for something growing inside her if she doesn’t want it there, and she has EVERY right to have it removed

            Pregnancy is physically difficult and dangerous. No one should be forced into it. EVER. Forced gestation is illegal a form of slavery. You’re a sick, disgusting person for wanting to FORCE women to endure pregnancy and childbirth against their will. You want women punished for their biology. How misogynistic and twisted is that?

            I will decide when and if I want to be a mother, and not a moment before. I will continue to enjoy a fulfilling, non procreationall sex life in my committed relationship. Get over it. Why do you want women punished for having sex drives and wanting to feel good? You view women as walking incubators and nothing more. How sad. You must be frigid. Heaven forbid you never get any. Go get laid and shut up.

        • Isa241

          You know what else is very expensive? Child support. Yet many
          men are forced to pay it. So shouldn’t you also argue against forced
          fatherhood? I mean if a woman has a right to kill another human inorder to avoid
          becoming a mother, shouldn’t the father at least have the right to opt out of
          helping to raise a child he didn’t want? Where’s his “choice”?

      • guest

         Sometimes women get raped and become pregnant. In which case consent is not implied.

      • Ninek

         If “women are losing their jobs all the time” because of pregnancy, why aren’t we solving that problem?  Why are we killing innocent children instead?

        • Misschels

          There are no “children” involved in abortion. Please learn basic biology.

          • Isa241

            “Child” is a word with multiple meanings, which
            is to say that it’s open to interpretation. Some dictionaries include “fetus” in
            the definition, some don’t.(http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/child)

            So whether or not someone wants to call a fetus a
            child is a matter of personal choice. And implying that it’s wrong to call a
            fetus a child is akin to saying that anyone who doesn’t think the same as you
            is wrong.

            But what is not open to interpretation is the
            biological fact that conception marks the moment when a new human life has
            begun.

            Please educate yourself before insulting the
            intelligence of others.

            http://www.westchesterinstitute.net/images/wi_whitepaper_life_print.pdf
            Please educate yourself before insulting the
            intelligence of others.

            http://www.westchesterinstitute.net/images/wi_whitepaper_life_print.pdf

          • Misschels

            No, moron. Being human isn’t the same as personhood. Sperm isn’t a person. Dandruff and fingernails aren’t people, yet they have “human” cells.

            I AM educated, thanks. You fail. Run along now.

      • Misschels

        Consent to sex is NOT consent to pregnancy.

        Try again.

        • Isa241

          “Consent to sex is not the same as consent to
          pregnancy”

          That is like a driver causing an accident and
          then saying they are not responsible because they didn’t intend for the
          accident to happen. They’re still responsible because the accident was a result
          of their actions.

          Pregnancy doesn’t just happen to you, it’s a
          direct result of a choice that you have made. Whether the result is intentional
          or not doesn’t make you any less responsible. Unless you think women are
          incapable of being responsible for their actions as well as their bodies?

          • Misschels

            “Pregnancy doesn’t just happen to you, it’s adirect result of a choice that you have made. Whether the result is intentional’or not doesn’t make you any less responsible”

            Um, no. When I have sex with my boyfriend, I say “I consent to having sex with you.” Not, “I consent to getting pregnant.”
            I’m sure you don’t “consent” getting in a car accident when you drive, or to drowning when you get into a pool. Hypocrite.

            “Unless you think women areincapable of being responsible for their actions as well as their bodies?”
            I think women are perfectly capable of being responsible for their actions as well as their bodies. Hence why I’m PRO-CHOICE. Moron. You’re the one who doesn’t think women are capable, because you want to make their decisions for them.

            Abortion IS taking responsibility. It’s terminating an unwanted pregnancy. Is that “not responsible” to you? Tough. If you don’t like it, don’t have one.  Thanks for playing.

    • Murray Vasser

      What is the difference between a “human” and a “human being”?  The Collins English Dictionary defines a “human being” as “a member of any of the races of Homo sapiens.”  Your movement would probably be more effective if you did not make up your own definitions.

    • Murray Vasser

      What are the “variety of factors” that determine the value of a human life?

    • Murray Vasser

      “NO ONE has the right to life at the expense of someone’s liberty, health or life.”

      This is a very odd statement.  Are you saying that if the existence of person A threatens the liberty of person B, then person B has the right to kill person A?  If that were the case, then the existence of person B would threaten the life of person A, and so, by the same principle, person A would have the right to kill person B. 

      You might want to reconsider this argument.

      • guest

         Self-defense. A common legal defense. Yes, a person has a right to kill someone is that person is a threat to their survival.

        • Elise77

          “Guest,” you like to talk about the exceptions a lot… the ones hardly anyone is even arguing about…
          Yes, if a woman’s life is in jeopardy, most of us think she should have the right to end the pregnancy. Distinguished from abortion, as I mentioned above, because it is not the intentional murder of the baby. Let’s say you’re holding a person’s hand to prevent them from falling over a cliff, but then you begin to slip yourself. Letting go of the person in order to save your life is not the same as deliberately killing that person. Women who end up with an ectopic pregnancy must have the baby removed to save their lives. Rick Santorum’s wife was induced at 20 weeks when pregnant with their son Gabriel, because her life was in danger. In neither case was the termination of the pregnancy a deliberate act against the life of the unborn child. Rather, the child died as a sad result of the necessary premature ending of the pregnancy.

          So once again I ask: Since you repeatedly use the exceptional cases to argue in favor of abortion, are you willing to concede that the other 90+ percent of abortions, when babies are conceived through consensual sex and there is no imminent threat to the mother’s life or health, should be stopped?

    • Isa241

      What is personhood or a human “being” and how does that differ
      from human? Or more importantly, what criteria do you use to determine the
      difference? Should “personhood” be defined by science or personal beliefs?

      Do we assign personhood to every member of our species regardless
      of age, gender, race, level of development and dependency?

      Or do we accept that it’s ok to use our own beliefs to
      determine the value of each human?

  • Velvet

    A fetus is a human.  But that doesn’t matter, because nobody can be forced to support the life of another human being with their own body against their will.  You can’t be forced to donate an organ, even if the recipient will die without it.  You can’t be forced to donate blood.  You can’t be forced to carry a pregnancy to term.  It’s not about that human’s value, but about the rights of the person whose life supports it.

    • Murray Vasser

      Are you arguing that because you can’t be forced to donate a kidney to someone, a mother should therefore be allowed to destroy her unborn child for any reason whatsoever?  Let’s say, for example, that the due date happens to correspond with a cruise that the mother planned a year in advance.  Do you believe that the mother has the right to have her unborn child torn to pieces so that she can go on that cruise?
       
      Pro-choicers routinely appeal to the health of the mother, but the pro-life/pro-choice debate concerns elective abortions, that is, abortions which are not medical necessities but which are preformed at the request of the mother.  I don’t believe the law should prohibit abortions in instances where the pregnancy is truly a serious threat to the health of the mother, and no other medical recourse is available.  But it simply does not follow that the unborn child can therefore be torn to pieces for any reason whatsoever.

      • Letscook1

         Why do you put the life of a fetus over the life of someone who needs a kidney? Donating blood is very simple, a lot simpler and safer than 9 months of pregnancy. And most healthy adults can do it. Yet there are always blood shortages in most hospitals and people die all the time from it. Should the government require every healthy person 17 and over to donate blood? It’s just a little pin prick.

        Do you think the government should be able to force dead people to donate their bodily organs? They are already dead so what should it matter to them? Why do dead people have the right to keep their organs and be buried with them?

        • SweetMarie

          Because we have no natural moral obligation to undergo a voluntary and artificial process to extract extraneous blood or organs for the use of others. It is certainly an admirable act of charity made possible by human ingenuity and technology but it is neither natural to our biology nor morally obligatory.We do, however, have a natural moral obligation to not undergo a voluntary and artificial process to exterminate our living offspring. To do so is an abhorrent act of murder, made possible by human ingenuity and technology and it is both unnatural to our biology and morally indefensible.It is clear that abortion is the action that correlates to the donation of blood and organs and not the state of being pregnant. Both abortion and the harvesting of our blood and tissues are deliberate and unnatural acts, the first undertaken to destroy another human’s life and second undertaken to save another human’s life, while gestation requires no deliberation, as it is a natural process of our female bodies, just like respiration or digestion or circulation.I’m curious – was this apples and oranges comparison an innocent lapse in logic or a deliberate attempt to deceive?

          • Misschels

            “Because we have no natural moral obligation to undergo a voluntary and artificial process to extract extraneous blood or organs for the use of others.” Exactly, the same applies to pregnancy. You just stated that no person has a moral obligation to donate blood without their consent. Well, a woman has no moral obligation to donate her body to a non viable fetus for nine months, either. Not only are you non-consistent in your argument, you’re a hypocrite. I doubt you’re doing anything to help actual BORN children, either. Are you donating to food banks, homeless shelters, or charities that feed starving children in africa? I doubt it. Only the fetus matters to you.Also, you stated that women have an obligaton to give birth. No, they don’t. That’s why abortion is legal. Women are not breeding machines, or walking incubators as you’d like them to be. Your misogynistic, twisted views make me sick. I will be a mother if and when I decide to be, and not a moment before. I choose my own destiny, and make my OWN decisions. Get over it.You want women to be slaves to their own bodies, and give birth against their will just so YOU can sleep better at night. You want to give a non viable embryo rights over a born, thinking, feeling person. You’re sick in the head. Abortion is not murder, nor does it fit the definition. You have no right to shove your morals into other people’s lives. Stay out of women’s reproductive organs.

          • ForsythiaTheMariner

            Oh my! What a lot of sweeping generalizations you’ve made. I don’t think @661445d51e64c0b9e693cdb85b28e974:disqus accused the person who commented of anything, she simply responded to the argument. Your post, on the other hand, directly accused someone of things you have zero knowledge about (unless you happen to know her, which, I doubt, is true). 

            Please refrain from such overwhelming generalizations like, “are you feeding starving children in Africa, I doubt it” and “you want women to be slaves”, especially when someone was polite and intelligent enough not to do that to you. 

          • Misschels

            Um, was I talking to you? Didn’t think so.

            Also, my argument was directed towards the person’s post about how women should have an obligation to their unborn offspring. I was responding to that. In case you haven’t noticed, this is a public forum. If you post something you should expect to get responses. If you can’t handle it then GTFO. Stop whining.

          • ForsythiaTheMariner

            “Um, was I talking to you? Didn’t think so.”"If you post something you should expect to get responses.”

            Brilliant work of self-contradiction. Well done!
            From an objective perspective, too, it seems to me like the only one “whining” on this board is you. 

          • Misschels

            Brilliant work of taking your time to respond to someone who doesn’t care about your opinion!

            Oh and I’m not “whining. I’m simply projecting facts and defending my rights as a woman, you’re the one whining because there’s nothing you can do about it.

            Thanks anyway. Run along now.

          • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_S2CGDZVTZF2OXB5CUKQUOVYYHU JacqueH

            Women DO have an obligation to their offspring. Your mother created you and was obligated to either care for you until you could care for yourself or find someone who would. Anything less would be neglect. Before birth, in the case of abortion, it is murder. If you don’t want to care for your own offspring, don’t spring off! You’ll remain free to live the completely self-centered existence that you demand at the expense of your child’s life and limbs, but without that pesky “killing your child” business.

             

          • Misschels

            No, sweetie, I don’t have an obligation to stay pregnant and give birth if I don’t want to.

            Oh and there are no ‘children’ involved in abortion. Learn the difference.

            Nice try.

          • Elise77

            First of all, the “fetus” is NOT “nonviable” for nine months. A baby can survive if born at less than six months gestation these days. Yet, they can still be brutally, violently killed throughout the pregnancy.
            Secondly, you accept the risk of pregnancy by participating in sex just like you accept the risk of an injury when you go hang gliding. You don’t get to “opt out” at the expense of SOMEONE ELSE’S LIFE. If you get pregnant via an act of consensual sex, YOU are responsible for the LIFE of the PERSON in your womb. I don’t have a moral obligation to donate blood or organs to some random stranger because I DID NOT CREATE THEM, NOR am I responsible for their health issues. AND YET I DONATE BLOOD AND I’M A REGISTERED MARROW DONOR.

            How about YOU??

            “Only the fetus matters to you blah blah blah.” Guess what, sweetie? Conservatives (including pro-lifers) are more charitable than Save-The-Whales-Kill-The-Babies liberals like yourself. So this TIRED VAPID talking point you’re exploiting (like you were the first person to think of it) is COMPLETELY INVALID. Would you like to sit down and compare donations/volunteer hours? PLEASE? Because I would HAPPILY do so, and so would almost everyone ELSE on this page. I can tell by your “MEEE MEEE” attitude EXACTLY where the less fortunate fall on YOUR priority list.

            A hundred years ago, farmers weren’t under legal obligation to pick their own cotton, and it was legal to force slaves to do it. Just because something’s “legal” doesn’t make it acceptable. But since you think it does, I assume that when Roe v. Wade is finally overturned, you will be fine with legal restrictions on abortion. That’s good to know.

            I am a woman and I have three daughters. And I do not need or want, for myself or my daughters, an artificial “right” to kill our offspring. I am not a “slave” to my body. I have full control over myself and my impulses, and I can choose to reproduce or not by controlling them. If the “right” to abortion helps guarantee “equality” with men, then it’s a BIG FAT STEP DOWN, because any MAN can destroy life. Only a WOMAN can create, grow, and nurture it.

            And I will “stay out of your reproductive organs,” I promise. Keep others out of them and you shouldn’t have to worry about motherhood. Which will be good for your potential future children, since you clearly see children as possessions that are supposed to exist and operate according to your convenience and at your behest. Good luck with that if you ever DO reproduce. That’s not quite how parenting works.

          • nicolec

             SING IT SISTA!

            I am on your train.
            I am reading the Theology of the Body as well as How To Find Your Soulmate Without Losing Your Soul… both fantastic. And both are really opening up my eyes to understand that our consequences have EVERYTHING to do with our personal actions. The people we choose to be with, sexually or romantically. Pro choice movement just wants to keep their “right” to have sex/fun without the responsibilities that  natural gave us.

            Plus don’t evolutionists agree that in order for our species to evolve/advance we must procreate? WE NEED VARIATION PEOPLES!

            Sounds a lot like social darwinism (Spencerism, my bad). More and more I am seeing the connections pop up in my Anthro classes and today’s issues.

            Devil’s work is what I call it and we keep feeding into his fire the more we bicker!! I would NEVER give him that satisfaction. I want my ticket to Heaven ;o)

          • Misschels

            “Pro choice movement just wants to keep their “right” to have sex/fun without the responsibilities that  natural gave us. ”

            Yes, we do. We also believe in giving women a CHOICE of their own.

            Thanks anyway.

          • Misschels

            What is it with you people wanting to punish women for having sex? I never hear you mention that a man should be forced to get a vasectomy, or keep his stuff in his pants. Oh well, I guess you’re just woman hating pigs. I feel bad for you. Anyway, just because you can’t get any doesn’t mean you should ruin it for the rest of us.

            Try getting laid, then maybe you’ll shut up.

          • Kimberly Hamann

            I feel that a guy SHOULD keep it in his pants unless he’s married. But, the buck figuratively stops with us females, so we need to take the responsibility. But an abortion isn’t one of those choices!

          • Misschels

            Having an abortion IS taking responsibility. It’s getting rid of an unwanted pregnancy. Abortion IS one of those choices. It’s legal, didn’t ya know? 

          • Kimberly Hamann

            Oh, and by the way: I DO get “laid”. Except my husband and I call it “making love”.

          • Misschels

            The “love making” must not be very good. Lol. I get laid to have an orgasm, not to breed. Does that bother you?

          • Misschels

            First or all, don’t call me “sweetie.” Your condescending tone really doesn’t do much for your argument except make you look like like it to yourself.Back to the subject, yes, you want to give the fetus rights over a fully developed, thinking, feeling, woman. Don’t try to white wash it. No, you don’t have an obligation to donate your blood or internal organs to another person. Even if they would die without it, you STILL don’t have to. IT’S YOUR BODY, AND YOUR CHOICE. Why do you think even dead people can’t have their organs donated unless they consented to it while they were alive?The same applies to pregnancy. A woman doesn’t have an obligation to donate her body and internal organs to a fetus.
            Your argument is not consistent, and you’re a hypocrite.A rapist is not allowed to violate someone else’s body without that person’s consent. Hence why it’s called RAPE. Pregnancy is no different. A fetus, embryo, baby, or whatever you want to call it, does NOT have the right to be in a woman’s body without her consent. Get it? Another thing, no I do NOT consent to getting pregnant by having sex. By your twisted logic, everytime you drive, you consent to crashing. Does that mean you shouldn’t recieve medical attention, or just be left to die? Same goes for swimming. If you drown, oh well, you chose to swim. See where I’m going with this?I am allowed to enjoy as much non procreating sex as I’d like in my committed relationship. GET OVER IT. I don’t have to be forced to carry a pregnancy I don’t want and give birth to a child I don’t want to just because it would make YOU happier. I’ll be a mother when I want to be and not a moment before. Your view that every woman has an obligation to be an incubator and pop babies out, is demeaning and disgusting. Oh and an embryo isn’t a ‘person.’ It can’t interact, talk, or have feelings.Being human and personhood aren’t the same thing. Please get a bit more educated on the subject before you try to debate with me.
            Being human and personhood aren’t the same thing. Please get a bit more educated on the subject before you try to debate with me.

            Yes, you do want woment to be slaves to their bodies. You want to FORCE them to “accept the consequences” of having sex and punish them with a child. You want them to go through nine months of physical, emotional, and mental trauma, have their stomach stretched out, ruin their body, and then finally go through agonizing labor AGAINST THEIR WILL. You want women punished for their biology. You’re sick. Pregnancy and childbirth is physically difficult, challenging, and dangerous. No one should be forced into it.

            Abortion IS a woman’s right. I control my life, my body, and my future. I decide when I will give birth and become a mother. I have complete control over my own destiny. Abortion is legal, and staying that way. We live in a free country and women have rights. Accept it, and shut up. You’re just bitter because you can’t force anyone to do anything. Oh and I WILL reproduce, WHEN I WANT TO. Deal with it, grow up, try seeing the bigger picture, and mind your own business.

          • Rach151

            I’m amused that you think a “fetus” can’t have feelings. You do know they react to their mother’s voice, and feel pain right? It seems to me that YOU’RE the hypocrite here.

          • Misschels

            I’m amused that you think a fetus does have feelings. They don’t. Oh and they can’t feel pain until the 2nd trimester. Most abortions are done in the 1st. Nope, you’re still the hypocrite.

            Thanks for playing.

          • loveoneanother

             Since you obviously only subscribe to a belief system that you have conjured up to meet your private set of Godless beliefs, please refrain from attempting to influence anyone to follow your totally selfish ideas.  You have NO credibility.  God created you for a beautiful life He plans for all who obey Him and you are buying into the whole egotistical ” Me First!” generation.  Sad and sickening.

          • Misschels

            No, sorry, YOU have no credibility. You’re the “sad” and “sickening” one for wanting to force your religious beliefs and morals into other people’s lives.

            Selfish? Forcing a total stranger to endure a pregnancy she doesn’t want and have a child she doesn’t want just because you decided abortion is ‘wrong’ and that what SHE thinks somehow doesn’t matter, is as selfish as it gets.

        • Elise77

          Why limit organ donation to dead people? By YOUR logic, anyone’s life is forfeit if they are dependent upon another person for their lives. We have burgeoning prison populations, and each of those people’s care and keeping costs a whole lot more than MINE does. And as a taxpayer I SUPPORT them. So since they are dependent on me, it follows, then, that I should be able to pick off one of them if I need an organ transplant, RIGHT? In fact, my 4 year old would probably not survive on his own without my help. So if I needed a kidney transplant I should just be able to take his, right? It’s him or me! My life depends on it! And most importantly, he’s DEPENDENT on me, so that gives me a right to do whatever I want to with him!

          • guest

             No, it doesn’t give you the right to do whatever you want with him because he, in fact, is not dependent on you. If you decided you didn’t want to take care of him you would options.

          • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_S2CGDZVTZF2OXB5CUKQUOVYYHU JacqueH

            What if she didn’t? Hypothetically, what if she was all alone with him and it would be 9 months before another person could care for him? Could she kill him then?

          • Misschels

            Nope. If someone or something is using MY BODY for survival and residing INSIDE me, I have every right to remove it. A 4 year old can be supported by anyone, but only I can sustain a fetus.

            Your logic fails.

    • Laura

      “A fetus is a human. But that doesn’t matter” I find vey troubling that knowing the former you wold think the later. You think it is morally acceptable to kill an inocent, defenseless human if s/he is an inconvenience to someone else. “It’s not about that human’s value, but about the rights of the person whose life supports it” what about the rights of that human who’s being murdered, or do you think only certain humans should have rights?

      • Letscook1

         People die everyday due to not having enough blood donations. Donating blood is a much simpler and easier procedure than 9 months of pregnancy. The vast majority of healthy adults qualify and could donate every 3 months without risks of complications but most people don’t want to be “inconvienced” with a little prick in their arm and a few minutes of light headedness. But it’s still not legally mandated even though people die from this. One can’t even take orgrans from the dead without their previous consent and the family’s consent even though it would save countless of lives. Why don’t you feel that people should be required to donate blood, or be forced to give their organs after they are dead? Why shouldn’t we all donate a kidney? It’s just a kidney, right? You can live perfectly fine with one.

        • Isa241

          In the United States you are generally not required to give
          aid to another person unless you are considered a caregiver (such as a parent
          or doctor) or you are in some way responsible for that person’s condition.  Some states also require you to provide reasonable
          aid to people when no other help is available. For example, if you drive upon a
          car accident you may (depending on which state you’re in) be required to stop
          and call 911 if no one else is around. But not all states require this and you’re
          generally not required to do much more than call for help.  However, if you are in some way responsible
          for or involved in the accident than you are legally obligated to call for help
          and remain on the scene until told you can leave.
          The difference is actually
          pretty clear, you are not generally responsible for people that you have no relationship
          to. You are however responsible for those in your care. When a woman gets
          pregnant she is responsible for the creation of a new human life and that life
          is in her care.

    • guest

       THANK YOU, Velvet. Why doesn’t anyone get that?

      • Misschels

        Simple, because they want to “save da babeeezz!” Which of course, only applies to embryos.

        • guest2

          You know, if all pro-lifers did was save embryos, they’d still be saving humans lives. And that’s something we as a society call people heros for doing.

          • Misschels

            You people are nothing close to heroes. I’d call american soldiers fighting for our freedom, heroes. Not wackjobs who want control over a woman’s uterus activity.

            Nice try.

          • Hero

            Heroes save or speak for those who can not save or speak for themselves. Why are prolifers not heroes? They subject themselves to hate and blurring of their character to support those who can not speak for themselves. They also support many charitable organizations, human rights, food banks, water cleaning groups… etc. Because the cause is not just the unborn, but humanity as a whole! It is also about helping those women who go through the violent act of abortion. This cause is not something that is taken lightly, it is the death of over 54 million Americans! More than any war in the past decade. This needs to be stopped. Instead of harping the old tune of “If you don’t want abortion, don’t get one”, how about “If you don’t want to get pregnant, don’t have sex!” Let’s take responsibility for our actions instead of killing an innocent to try to not deal with the consequences of our actions.

          • Misschels

            You speak for a voice that can’t be heard, and doesn’t exist. I speak for a voice that exists and took hundreds of years to be heard.

            By your logic, I could say the same about everything else that has “risks and consequences.” If you don’t want to crash, don’t drive! If you don’t want to drown, don’t swim! If you don’t want to get mugged, don’t go out in public! Your logic FAILS. I will continue to enjoy a very fulfilling sex life without procreation, whether you like it or not.

            Let’s stay out of other people’s sex lives and reproductive organs, and mind our own business.

            Go get laid and shut up.

          • Kimberly Hamann

            not spending much time worrying about your sex life…I have my own.

          • Misschels

            Well, dear, your “sex life” must suck if you think it’s only meant for procreation. Just sayin.’

          • Misschels

            Observed kinds of people against abortion on the internet:-religious zealots lacking any compassion-children regurgitating the propaganda they have been spoon fed-socially maladjusted men who think of women as just birthing machines-freaks that think of children as a punishment for sexually active women-dried up or infertile women jealous of fertile women-slutty single moms who want people to pat her on the back for birthing-child molesters who want a steady stream of victims

            Yep, you definitely fall into some of these categories. Haha.

          • Kimberly Hamann

            Sorry, sweetie. Don’t fit into any of your stereotypes: married, 4 kids, female, been sexually active for 20-plus years, not a member of a cult, not a slut, not a child molester. 

          • Misschels

            I’d say you’re 1, 4 and 5. Definitely.  

          • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_S2CGDZVTZF2OXB5CUKQUOVYYHU JacqueH

            I control my own uterus activity. That’s what real women do. If you controlled yours, you wouldn’t demand abortions. If you can’t handle functioning female reproductive organs, the problem is YOU.

            People who suggest that women need to right to surgery that kills the children we create in order to be “free” seriously demean womanhood.

            P.S. For the record, I don’t care what you do with your uterus as long as you refrain from killing any human beings you put there.

          • Oedipa

            “I control my own uterus activity. That’s what real women do. If you controlled yours, you wouldn’t demand abortions.”

            Pine all you want for the entire population to exercise your version of “personal responsibility”, but what do we do (as a country) when they don’t? Because that’s called reality.

            Your comments reveal that there’s too much desire to stigmitize, shame, penalize and control women baked into the pro-life message. Maybe it’s sublimating for some other kind of desire?

          • Misschels

            Yes, the desire to force all women into having babies, which is apparently, to the pro life movement, their only purpose it life.

            You people are sick minded.

          • Misschels

            “I control my own uterus activity. That’s what real women do. If you controlled yours, you wouldn’t demand abortions. If you can’t handle functioning female reproductive organs, the problem is YOU. ”

            Wow, at least you admit your hatred of women and your view of them as only incubators. Great job!

            A real woman is not defined by her uterus. A real woman doesn’t tell other women what to do with their bodies, either. The fact that you’ve bred doesn’t make you more of a woman or better then anyone else. Find some real credibility in life besides just “having children.” Better yet, take your ignorant, misogynistic views somewhere else.

          • Misschels

            Observed kinds of people against abortion on the internet:

            -religious zealots lacking any compassion
            -children regurgitating the propaganda they have been spoon fed
            -socially maladjusted men who think of women as just birthing machines
            -freaks that think of children as a punishment for sexually active women
            -dried up or infertile women jealous of fertile women
            -slutty single moms who want people to pat her on the back for birthing
            -child molesters who want a steady stream of victims

            Yep, every single pro-lifer definitely falls into one of these categories. Haha.

          • Misschels

            By the way, mr. we are the world, who plans on supporting all these unwanted embryos you’re trying to save? The welfare system?

      • guest2

        What is morally wrong to do to a viable human adolescent is also morally wrong to do to a non-viable human fetus.

        • Misschels

          Wrong. I have every right to remove something, viable or non-viable, from MY body anytime I wish.

          Try again.

          • guest

            I used to feel the way that you did, but I understand now that all life is valuable and to be involved in the act of termination is murder.  There is a difference between removing something and someone from your body.  Once we start categorizing which lives should/should not be valued we start heading down the road that the Nazis travelled  down in Germany prior to and during WWII.  You seem like a guy who thinks for himself and is very passionate.  I challenge you to watch a video called “180″ from start to finish on youtube with an open mind.  I hope that you will change your mind.   

          • Misschels

            If all life is valuable, then I hope you’re a vegetarian, and against war and capital punishment. Otherwise you’re hypocrite. You can’t just be pro life for fetuses.

            Another thing, what is so “valuable” about life?” It happens every day, and ends every day. It’s an ongoing process. There’s nothing valuable about it. Not that it really matters, because nothing can use my body for survival without my permission. Look up BODILY AUTONOMY. Abortion is NOT murder. It’s not my fault that an embryo can’t sustain life on it’s own, and also not my problem.

            Please don’t compare a legal medical procedure to the holocaust. It’s insulting to actual victims, since hilter ordered the killing of BORN, sentient, living people who weren’t violating his bodily autonomy. It’s NOT the same, so stop pretending it is.

            I have watched the 180 movie. It’s biased and pro life propagnada. If anything, it made me even more pro choice.I used to think like you. I used to be anti choice. Then I gew up, matured, got a bit more intelligent, and saw the biggere picture. It’s not my place to tell another woman what to do with her pregnancy. EVER.

            I will never change my mind.

          • Misschels

            It took hundreds of years for women to gain their rights. We won’t go backwards. Plain and simple, It’s completely up to the woman whether or not she wants to continue her pregnancy, not the government, you, or any other wackjob who wants control over reproductive organs. A fetus can’t use a woman’s body against her will. Bodily autonomy is a basic right, look it up.

            Pro “lifers” aren’t doing much stop abortion except harrass women going into abortion clinics. In fact, if you look at statistics, more then half of all pro “lifers” have had or will have an abortion in their lifetime. Pro choicers are the only ones helping to lower abortion rates.

            No one is “truly” pro life. I figured this out a long time ago, because at one time, I was “pro life” also. A hard core lifer at that. Now that I’ve grown up, become intelligent and matured out of that mindset, I’m able to speak out about the issue on a realistic level. Abortion will never end. Making it illegal won’t stop t from happening, and if I don’t know if you’ve ever been to a country where it IS illegal, but the results aren’t pretty. Women are dying because of denied rights to choose.

            Getting to the point, no matter how you look at the issue, or how you feel about it, the choice is COMPLETELY up the the woman. It’s her body, her mind, her life, HER choice. No one else’s.  It’s a personal decision, not a legal or religious issue. A woman has the last say over her uterus. Now let’s focus on more productive issues, like all the BORN children dying, shall we?

          • Guest

            Oh goodness. First, you have realized that your mother did not kill you. And second, I hope you do not breed. 

          • Misschels

            I realize my mother did not “kill” me. However, she’s prochoice. I wouldn’t want to force my mother to give birth if she didn’t want to. I have more respect for her then that.

            Also, I will breed. It’s my CHOICE to do so. What part of it’s someone’s CHOICE do you morons not get?

          • Misschels

            I guess you don’t care if women die for fetuses?

            Oh goodness.

  • http://www.facebook.com/angelheart4895910 Donna Fontenot Baughman

    I BELIVE AS SOON AS THE GIFT FROM GOD,AS LITTLE AS A MUSTERD SEED,THE EMBRO IS GROWING INTO ITS REACHED  ITS GOAL TO PUSH OUT INTO,THE WORLD!THAT THIS FROM THE BEGINNING TO THE END TO,ENTER!! LIFE PEOPLE SHOULD ENTER NO MATTER WHAT CIRCUMSTANCES,ITS LIFE AND DESERVES TO LIVE.

    • Misschels

      Uh, wrong. Not everyone believes in your god, and more importantly, an unwanted pregnancy is no “gift.” It’s a burden, and women don’t have to donate their bodies to fetuses for nine months and give birth just to make YOU happy.

      Nice try.

  • Kimberly Hamann

    Misschels: boy are you an angry, bitter person! sounds like most pro-choicers to me. If you don’t want to deal with an unwanted pregnancy, abstain! Or use one of the many birth control methods available to you. And, my dear, I don’t want to go anywhere near your reproductive organs…and stay out of my church, my schools and my children’s education!!! And don’t use my tax dollars to pay for your birth control/abortion. You already have freedom of choice-before you take the clothes off!! No other person should pay for your lack of morals, self-control, etc. Silly child, sex is for adults!!

    • Oedipa

      “sounds like most pro-choicers to me” You’re just as bad as him, right there.

      “don’t use my tax dollars to pay for your birth control/abortion” You know what I wish? I wish my tax dollars didn’t go to that stupid war in Iraq. But they did.

      “Silly child, sex is for adults!!” Preferably with contraceptives ;-)

      • Kimberly Hamann

        Sorry. Nowhere near as bad as this person. This little dialog is a textbook case of what most pro-aborts use in their discussions. They enjoy putting you down, dissing other’s views that are not the same as their’s. Been my experience for YEARS. I’ve yet to have a respectful, logical debate with a pro-abort. I never stated that I was against contraceptives, I just don’t want my tax dollars paying for them…they can pay for it themselves!! (maybe our war-mongering politicians should pay for the wars themselves…just an idea? I think you just made a good point there!) I was just making an observation…

        • Misschels

          You willingly came onto a public forum, posted a comment, and now you’re whining because you got your ass handed to you. Typical pro lifer.

          Oh and I’m not pro abort, I’m pro choice. Learn the difference.

        • Misschels

          Did you just say that you DON’T want your tax dollars paying for birth control? Wow, why make contraceptives more available so there will be less abortions? Make it so the women who can’t afford it will just have abortions, resulting in more abortions.

          You’re an idiot.

    • Misschels

      “Misschels: boy are you an angry, bitter person! sounds like most pro-choicers to me.”

      Hahaha.

      Okay, first of all, sweetie, I’m neither angry nor bitter. I’m a very happy person with an amazing life and free CHOICE. That must bother you so much, huh? I guess you could say, yes, I AM angry, at people like you who want to control women and force them to remain pregnant and give birth just so YOU can be happier. Oh and if I don’t want to be pregnant, abstain? So if you don’t want to crash, then you better never drive. If you don’t want to drown, better not swim. See how your logic fails. Your sex life must suck if you only do it to breed. Just sayin’.

      “Before you take your clothes off…”Slut shaming now, are we? How pathetic. Only a misogynistic pig like you would want to PUNISH other women for having sex.

      “Or use one of the many birth control methods available to you.”Birth control fails, idiot.

      “If you don’t want to deal with an unwanted pregnancy, abstain!”

      Honey, I’m MARRIED. I’m not going to abstain from fucking my husband, and I AM an adult, so before you attempt to throw around condesending insults or ASSumptions, get the FACTS first. A fetus cannot use my body for survival without my continued permission, you silly little girl. You sound angry and bitter because there’s nothing you can do about it. When you’re ready to face reality, then come debate with the adults. Until then, shut the EFF up. Your ‘morals’ have no place in other people’s lives.

  • Kimberly Hamann

    Uh, I happen to have an AMAZING sex life with my husband…I’m also a 40 year old. I HAVE used birth control when needed; I understand that not all folks think that’s ok. I’m not against it. but I am against abortion. Honey, I have so much more freedom than you could ever understand! You don’t bother me so much-I don’t give folks like you much thought. Having a child isn’t punishment! Wow. As far as me not being powerless about your life: you are right. I can’t do anything about it, AND I DON’T CARE! I have my own life to live, but abortion is going the way of the dinosaur…and I vote, so I have a say… Sorry to some of you if I’m blunt…meekness isn’t my strong point. I don’t care if I offend people..I am offended all the time by the lack of morality in this country. People need to speak up. Stand for something or you will fall for anything! I am fed up with people thinking that others need to give them something or cater to their every whim/fantasy/deviation. The entitlement attitude in America is disgraceful. I love how you pro-aborts get so riled up when a pro-lifer tells you like it is, but you can go around insulting my life, views, push YOUR morals around, (I should say lack of-your wonderful use of cursing betrays you) !!! I wish my tax dollars weren’t paying for wars, either. But to call me a misogynistic pig…I am a woman!! I love being a woman. Please, keep your morals out of my life, church and children’s school…

    • Misschels

      Okay, sweetie, let me clear a few things up for ya.First of all, you didn’t tell anyone “how it is.” pro-choicers tell you how it is and then you go crying about it. Grow up.

      Second, there’s nothing to speak up about. Abortion IS a woman’s choice and right, PLAIN AND SIMPLE. If you don’t like it then move to a third world country where abortion is illegal. The results are tragic, because both the woman AND the fetus end up dead. Why the HELL would you want that? Why the hell are you fighting for that? So not just one, but two lives are destroyed?Oh, I forgot, you’re a pro LIFER. You don’t care about born people. Honey, before you call yourself “pro life” check yourself. I doubt your a vegetarian, donating any of your internal organs to save lives, donating to homeless shelters and food banks, or to charities that help feed starving children in africa. You’re ONLY pro life for a fetus. All you care about is the contents of a woman’s uterus. You are NOT “pro-life” so stop bullshitting around and pretending to be.

      Another thing, Pro choice is NOT pro abortion. We don’t FORCE women to abort. We give them the option. So no, I am NOT pro abortion. You want to take away women’s options and force them to give birth, so you are ANTI-CHOICE. When pro choicers start forcing women to have abortions against their will, then, and only then, will you have an argument.The sooner you realize that I have EVERY right to remove something from my body if I don’t want it there, and that someone else’s pregnancy is none of your concern, the better off we’ll all be. It doesn’t matter if it’s “human.” It’s my body, my uterus, my mind, my life, MY CHOICE. Get it? Abortion is legal and staying that way. Get over it. Worry about yourself and your “amazing sex life” instead of telling other people how to live, and what to do with their bodies. It’s MY pregnancy, and I have the final say. Not you, the government, the church, or any other wackjob out there who thinks they know what’s best for me and my life more then I do.

      I am so sickened by “women” like you, who want to FORCE other women to carry unwanted pregnancies to term and give birth, and FORCE them to become mothers regardless of what they want. That’s disgusting. Who are YOU to decide the fate of a pregnant woman for her?

      This war on women’s rights has GOT to end.

      Your morals are just that, your morals. Keep them out of my life.

    • Marquezcn

      Expanding your argument of hypocrisy, I would add that pro-lifers, at least in SC, also don’t care about the high infant mortality rate (40% above national average), our “minimally adequate” education failure, or enlightened sex education that would prevent many abortion discussions.

  • http://www.lempacreative.com/ Dale Lempa

    Too bad the comment board turned into a catfight, but I think that Murray is spot-on here.  The objection regarding donating blood is fully answered by the obligation to care.  People will always be dying, but that doesn’t necessitate their murder.

    • Misschels

      Nope. Abortion isn’t murder, nor does it fit the definition.

      Thanks for playing.

  • Bocker

    What a load of bullsh*t this quiz is.